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tv   Reliable Sources  CNN  July 27, 2014 8:00am-9:01am PDT

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hello, i'm wolf blitzer live in israel. reliable sources will begin in just a few minutes but first i want to bring you up to date on the latest developments here in the middle east. there is now a lot of doubt about whether or not a new cease-fire will take place. hamas says it has agreed to a 24-hour cease-fire. diplomats from the united nations are works very intensively right now to try to create what they're calling a humanitarian pause. yesterday israel said it was unilaterally extending a cease-fire that was supposed to begin, but hamas rejected the israeli extension and overnight israel resumed military operations in gaza after mortar fire from gaza killed an israeli soldier. the israelis also said it was responding to what it called incessant shelling throughout the earlier cease-fire from hamas in gaza. earlier i spoke with the united nations special coordinator for
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middle east peace and heard his appeal. listen to this. >> appeal on both sides to now show utmost restraint for this humanitarian pause to become effective i hope as soon as possible. >> let's go to gaza right now. cnn's karl penhaul is on the scene for us. karl, it seems to me based on what i'm seeing in gaza and in southern israel right now not far from gaza, there is no cease-fire. shelling continues, the air strikes continue from israel and hamas continues firing rockets and missiles from gaza. what are you seeing? >> reporter: yeah. i believe that you ar reportingn that, wolf, is absolutely correct. that's pretty much in line with what we're seeing from here as well. there is very much to and fro
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offers of counteroffers are coming in all the time. hamas agreed to the earlier offer of the cease-fire extension, that israeli offer would have allowed israeli troops on the ground to continue to go off militant tunnels and militant rocket launches, in essence to continue to destroy hamas infrastructure. and that in many ways you can read between the lines. hamas felt that that was a very lopsided cease-fire which is why they didn't agree to that one. and then when we saw israel pull the plug on its own cease-fire offer because of that heavy rocket fire from the gaza strip, which the al qassam brigades themselves took responsibility for. then there was a period of very heavy shelling kocoming from th eastern border. just after midday local time at one point the artillery shelling was so heavy that even the smell of high-explosive residue was drifting in to the offices here
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in gaza city. that is just to give you an idea of how heavy that was. shortly after that is when we hear hamas' offer of a 24-hour cease-fire under some kind of un mandate. and then that has all fallen apart as well. about an hour and a quarter ago another statement online from hamas' military wing the al qassam brigades saying that they fired off another five rockets into israel. it doesn't look like any of the sides are listening to one another. certainly no prospect of a cease-fire right now looking at what's going on on the ground, wolf. >> it looks very, very grim indeed. karl, be safe over there. let's get the israeli perspective right now. joining us now, the spokesman for the idf, the israel defense forces, lieutenant colonel peter lerner. colonel, what's your understanding about an effort of a cease-fire between israel and hamas right now? >> well, basically, wolf, it just goes to show what we've seen over the last three weeks
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now. every time there's been a substantial suggestion of cease-fire on the ground, hamas have fired rockets and indeed throughout the course of the day even after they declared that they were carrying out a cease-fire they fired more rockets at our citizens. so this just goes to show why we need to be persistent and take these tunnels out of the equation, take the rockets out of the equation, and safeguard the state of israel. yesterday i spoke to some of the commanders in the field and indeed i have visited the tunnels just recently over the weekend. what you see is a huge strategic decision on behalf of hamas to infiltrate israel. some three kilometers-long tunnel, 28,000 elements of cement. each tunnel like this -- we've exposed 31 -- costs about $1 million. so this is $31 million that could have been invested in the civilian population of gaza. but they actually decided that they want to invest in this
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infrastructure that has only one purpose -- death and destruction of israelis. we won't permit that to happen. we are fighting now to sever those capabilities and that is what we're doing. >> yesterday you told me it would probably take at least another week for the idf, the israel defense forces, to finish the job as far as those tunnels from gaza into israel. is that still your assessment? >> well, wolf, we are continuing to demolish these capabilities and decommission tunnels. we've released several videos showing the demolition of these tunnels. and you see how extensive they are. in order to have i would say a complete picture of it, indeed we have voiced the need for at least a week in order to be pretty concise and complete. we can't demolish less in less time, clearly, but we want to take this threat off of the table. we don't want these tunnels in
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our backyards. we're taking the fight to hamas in their backyards and they are paying the price for this aggression. >> so there's no cease-fire at least for now. lieutenant colonel peter lerner of the idf, spokesperson for the idf, thanks very much for joining us. let's get the palestinian perspective right now. the chief palestinian negotiator is joining us on the phone. thanks very much for joining us. first of all, listen to what the prime minister of israel, benjamin net tanyahu told our o candy crowley about a possible cease-fire. >> hamas doesn't even accept its own cease-fire. it's continued to fire at us as we speak. israel has accepted five cease-fires since this conflict beg began. five. we implemented them. including two cease-fires in the last 24 hours which hamas rej t
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reject rejected, so you say israel resumed our offensive. no, we didn't resume our offensive. we had a cease-fire, they violated it and now they're violating their own cease-fire. obviously we will take whatever action is necessary to protect our people including against the terror tunnels that they're trying to dig against us. >> i know you and president mahmoud abbas of the palestinian authority have been working very hard to achieve a cease-fire. where does it stand from your perspective right now, the effort to stop the fighting? saeb erakat, can you hear me? i think we're having some trouble connecting with the chief palestinian negotiator. let me just make sure that we haven't lost him completely. saeb erakat, can you hear me? it's wolf blitzer. we have him on the line but obviously we're having some major problems with that connection. we're going to try to reconnect
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with saeb erakat. we'll get the very latest on what's going on from the palestinian perspective. obviously there is a lot going on right now. there's no cease-fire. clearly hamas rockets and missiles keep coming in to israel and israel keeps pounding away. their primary objective right now those tunnels going from gaza into israel. then of course they're going after other targets of hamas as well. let me just double check, make sure we haven't lost completely saeb erakat. saeb, are you there with us? can you hear me, saeb erakat? all right. we're going to try to o fix that line. we'll update all of our viewers on what's going on. we'll speak to saeb erakat and get all of the perspective. in the meantime we're watching this very dangerous situation unfield fou unfold here in the middle east. for our international viewers watching right now, becky
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anderson will pick up our coverage with "connect the world." let's go back to cnn's "reliable sources." >> thank you, wolf. our top story on "reliable sources this morning," what you just said -- the battle line of ideas in the middle east. i'll be talking with a palestinian woman who had a very public blou-up with msnbc about the network's coverage of gaza. "new day" anchor chris cuomo is talking about the other huge story this week, the investigation into that downed malaysian airlines flight. he was there at crash site last weekend and has quite a story to tell. and there is a "washington post" reporter you should know about. he is sitting in an iranian jail cell detained for no apparent reason. we have an update from "the washington post" on his status. all that and more after the break. really... so our business can be on at&t's network for $175 dollars a month? yup. all five of you for $175. our clients need a lot of attention. there's unlimited talk and text. we're working deals all day. you get 10 gigabytes of data to share. what about expansion potential?
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in a moment, i'll talk about jeffrey goldberg. he's been writing about the israeli/palestinian conflict for decades and has been called a self-hating jew many times. that's actually one of the nicer e-mails he's gotten. let's start though by bringing up one of the elephants in this crowded room. which voices get to be heard? and which ones don't? because if you want to hear the whole story, you've got to hear everybody. now you've probably heard a commentator on msnbc earlier this week starting a heated conversation when she brought up what she thinks is a severe imbalance in the american media, an imbalance that favors israel. take a look at what she said. >> we are ridiculous. we are disgustingly biased when it comes to this issue. look at how many air time netanyahu and his folks have on air on daily basis. andrea mitchell and others.
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i never see one palestinian. >> and after that, her other msnbc appearances were canceled. so what happened? let's ask her. she's here with me on set. thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me. >> so do have you any regrets about speaking up while on msnbc's air? >> no. sometimes you need to do what is right, not what is popular. i know that what is popular is to follow the narrative that one side of the conflict is right and the other side is wrong. i think coming from the region, coming from that area exactly and having covered so many other conflicts, i can tell you that the reality is much more complex. >> every night on "the situation room" i've been watching here on cnn, you'll see their hamas official or a palestinian official interviewed. you've also seen people like benjamin netanyahu interviewed on the israeli side. you're not just referring in that sound bite to msnbc. you feel the american press in general is biassed in favor of israel and against the palestinians? >> absolutely, yes.
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this is a narrative that's been for the last, i would say, three, four decades has been a narrative that is very biased. >> you've been in news rooms for years. you must have some theories about why there is this imbalance that you see. >> look, i just came from a business trip from europe where i was on air and i saw how the coverage of the conflict in gaza. i was also in israel recently and i saw how the coverage. i think here there is fear, intimidation, a campaign of intimidation and fear, if are you not aligned, your motives are questions. you are questions if you're antisemitic, or anti-israeli. >> it comes from where? >> it comes from multiple sources. even if you are questioned that, you are yourself questioned and depicted and pro-palestinian. >> you are an msnbc contributor under contract. your contract expired last month. it seems like a coincidence what happened last week. if it is fair and balanced,
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doesn't your regular appearance on msnbc show that there are people like you being able to voice these issues? >> but you can't put me against israel official. i am a journalist and i criticize hamas as much as i criticize the palestinian authority and others. my role is not to defend the palestinian people. >> what happened after that appearance? you said on twitter that your forthcoming appearances were then canceled. was that because of what you said about msnbc on the air? >> well, i was -- they e-mailed me and asked me if i can be there. i said absolutely yes. then immediately after that appearance i was canceled. >> msnbc claims that they were bumped in order to reair an interview chris hayes had with a 15-year-old palestinian beaten by israeli forces. >> but beating up a palestinian, which is a great news story, i think, has nothing to do with
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what i do. i am a foreign policy analyst that happened to understand the region, that speak hebrew and arabic, that interviewed officials on both sides. >> was their statement nonsense? is. >> well, you have to ask them i think at this point. i have no idea but it's somehow i feel i have complicated feelings about what happened. >> you were invited back on msnbc later in the week. chris hayes brought you on. you were labeled in that segment "palestinian journalist." how did you feel when you saw that graphic on the bottom of the screen? >> i have to say, i felt terrible because i was hired by msnbc and for two years i was labeled as analyst, journalist, foreign policy expert. i was contributor. i was never labeled "palestinian journalist." i don't know where you come from exactly, but if somebody would label you a methodist, united methodist, white man, your ethnicity?
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who does that? who labels people -- or you invite allan dershowitz under a label him a "jewish lawyer." did i become palestinian because this way you can describe me as emotional and as bias? and this way can avoid the debate about who is really biased on this issue? i think they need to give these answers not to me, to their audience. >> thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me. >> jebreal's opinions are controversial. after we talked i thought a lot more about what she said. i think journalists in the region and anchors here in the u.s. would love to interview hamas leaders, for example. but those are very difficult interviews to get. they rarely agree to come on camera, and some who do speak for hamas do not speak english. one spokesman who does was on "the situation room" with wolf blitzer three days in a row this week. now take a look at this. just a few of the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu's
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interviews on american networks in recent weeks. overall, israeli representatives seem to be more ready available for interviews. but that does not abdicate media outlets from their responsibility to be fair. i did share rula's comments about msnbc so they'd have to response to respond but they referred to their earlier statement. jebreal's contributor deal with msnbc officially ended last month when she said she wanted to pursue new opportunities. we've welcomed her back on msnbc several times since. they are voice is one of many palestinian voices on msnbc. we want to know what you think. after the break we'll stay on the topic of perceived media bias and the middle east. we are lucky enough to have one of the preeminent voices on the beat standing by. stay tuned. [announcer] word is getting out. purina dog chow light & healthy is a deliciously tender and crunchy kibble blend.
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welcome back to "reliable sources." one of the chief complaints from palestinians about american coverage of the israeli-palestinian conflict is that their voices are underrepresented. rula jebriel just brought that up in our last segment. one of the chief complaints from israelis that the coverage skews perceptions of what's going on. pictures from gaza like these. they're just so hard to watch and they're mostly civilians. many of them shelter. >> it's gruesome. they use telegenically dead palestinians for their cause. they want the more dead, the better. >> reporters covering this conflict are not just bystanders in all this, they are players and they're under pressure from all sides. no one exemplifies this better than jeffrey goldberg, a national correspondent for "the atlantic," and one of the foremost writes on the topic of the northeast.
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he joins me now from washington. tell me about what it is like for you over the course of many years to write about this topic. i feel like you're the kind of guy, you don't seem to pull punches. maybe as a result you get a lot of punches thrown back at you. what's your in box like on a daily basis? >> because of the immediacy of twitter, i can be called within ten minutes a zicho nazi jewish devil and sort of a self-hating jew from someone else because i said something critical of israeli policy. you know, if you go into this aspect of our business, you're just going to get it in the neck. >> there are a lot of people i know, a lot of people in our business who specifically stay away from this issue because they don't want to deal with the incoming ininvestigative invect. >> you mean they choose not to write about the topic or choose to do so in a way that's less
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aggress sniff. >> especially now that we have all these platforms to sort of opine instantly, i've had friends of mine say that i'd like to -- every so often they sort of tip toe in, they link to something or they'll just mention something in passing. then they'll get 100 angry eflt mails or tweets or whatever about the subject. like okay, thank you very much, i'm going to step away from the computer right now because i'm not equipped for this, i don't want to deal with this level of invective. i think there is a high barrier to entry. if you ask any reporter in a field, someone who's the editor of a big newspaper or tv network, they'll tell you their in box is overflowing with people who smaimultaneously thi incredibly different things about their work. >> many years ago you served in the israeli military police system as a prison guard. could i see how that could help
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your reporting. i could also see people accusing you of bias for that reason. >> the funny thing about that -- the reason people know that is because i wrote a book about the experience and what with i wrote in the book -- the book is actually an anti-occupation book. i became sort of very much opposed to the occupation of the west bank after that experience. this was 25 years ago. but after that experience. but what i find amusing is that people will use that as proof that i'm anti-israel and people will use that as proof that i'm pro-israel. very few of those people have read the book. >> you mentioned on your blog this week, it is true that hamas makes it difficult to report on matters that it would rather not see come to light. this is why you see so few photos, if any before of harmed hamas fighters. do you see a difference in the availability of representatives? >> not in their availability but in past experience with hamas,ive of's had very unusual
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experiences in gaza because even though i'm jewish, hamas is a very sophisticated public relations operation. they've always treated me with respect and tried to give me access. i've interviewed most of the hamas leaders, many of whom are dead now, having been assassinated. but they've always been good on that. however, when they don't want you to see something, like hamas has an interest in making you believe that this war is about an israeli military attacking gaza civilians. obviously inle many cases civilians are being killed tragically. but what israel is trying to do is fire against these rocket teams that are firing rockets into israel that hamas does not want you to see those rocket teams. they're fairly direct about making sure that reporters don't see those things. so there is that. on the other hand, like i said, in my strange experience with them i've had harder times with fatah which is ostensibly the more moderate movement in gaza.
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i was kidnapped once by fatah. i've never been kidnapped by hamas. maybe that's a low standard of judging who is nice to you, but i think hamas is fairly sophisticated about this. but yes, they definitely don't want you to see certain things. they definitely want their story portrayed a certain way. >> thank you so much for sharing what you experience day to day as someone who covers these conflicts all the time. >> thanks for having me. now we need to fit in a break here but when we come back, we'll switch topics to the other huge story dominating the news this week. that's the crash of mh flight 17. hear from one of cnn's journalists who spent time at the crash site and whose first instinct was to fall to his knees and say a prayer there. he'll join me right after this. ] the mercedes-benz summer event is here. now get the unmistakable thrill... and the incredible rush... of the mercedes-benz you've always wanted. ♪ [ tires screech ] but you better get here fast... [ daughter ] yay, daddy's here! here you go, honey. thank you. [ male announcer ] ...because a good thing like this... phew! [ male announcer ] ...won't last forever. see your authorized dealer for an incredible offer
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the downing of malaysia flight 17, a plane crash in what's the middle of essentially a war zone. that gruesomeness compounded by
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anarchy. that brought out the best and sometimes the worst in the journalists who were there, who were, and still are, our eyes and ears on the ground. cnn's "new day" co-anchor chris cuomo was there at the crash site last weekend. when he came back to new york i wanted to ask him about his first-hand experiences both in front of and behind the cameras. take a look. >> when i was watching you at the crash site, saturday morning now eight days ago, it stopped me in my tracks when you talked about what you want dodd when you first arrived. let's play that clip. >> the first thing i felt like doing when i came here was just getting down on my knees and saying a prayer for those who are gone because they are not getting the dignity that this situation deserves. >> rarely, if ever, do we hear that kind of emotion from a reporter on the scene, even of something like a plane crash. what was going through your mind? >> well, i think you have to look at it through the lens of "we." it was not a unique feeling to me, it wasn't a unique instinct or action or behavior. a lot of people were there
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thinking hard about what was going on, worrying about them. there was an amazing amount of concern. the cnn teams that were there, we came upon it, we knew this is not the way it is supposed to happen. not even about the impetus for what happened there. but that scene from the moment it was created was being abused and to see how the dead were being abused and the indignity of it was so obvious that it was not a unique sensation to me. don't think could you have done anything else coming upon it, frankly. >> i heard you say on air thursday, you thought if the media hadn't been there, you would have nobody preserving this scene. do you think the cameras were playing an accountability function? >> i believe the cameras were investigative tools before they are reported tools there and i could see it in the behavior of the media. >> you mean before there were actual investigators on site? >> there are no investigators on site. even now. a week, plus after it, can you fairly say, sure, they're trying to get investigators there, but we don't see an international
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effort, or certainly one by you a crane. you can watch cameramen and photo journalists taking pictures of things almost just to kind of create a site map. as opposed to what the best transitions and best sequences of photos were. and often the media deserves the criticism of milking situations, no question about it. not this time. >> i wonder if you saw once you got back this now viral video of a sky news reporter ruffling through luggage. i'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. is it a trauma covering a story like that that might lead a reporter to start ruffling around? >> i think that -- to make the case for what the reporter did, going through the luggage and the disrespect for the personal effects was something that we created over time as a metaphor for the indignity of the situation. the first glance, your first
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effort on scene to figure out who was there, i don't know that it would be an unreasonable thing to do. >> he did apologize profusely afterwards. >> he did. he did. >> for what happened. >> peter, why are you afraid to hear what i'm saying? i'm not here to fight with you. okay? >> i'm not afraid. i would like you to ask the u.s. government to release all of its data from satellites and compare it to the russian case, see where they match, where they don't match. no, they're not. you're living in a parallel universe. >> peter. >> did you come away thinking that you had achieved anything through that interview? >> yes, absolutely. i think it gave the audience an opportunity to see the propaganda machine at play there. now that's not to say that la vel wasn't making some points. he was. i've made some of those -- ironically while he was beating me over the head with this, i push our representatives also to do a real forensic, a real
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make-the-case thing here. don't just say there was overwhelming evidence. or, it is very clear. you have to show us. because there are many who doubt the u.s. when it comes to intelligence. however, i had absolutely zero intention, desire or inclination to debate the merits of who did this versus russia, ukraine, the militants. zero. my precise interest was in insulating the victims from being pawns in that discussion. all i asked was why didn't russia condemn the actions of the crime scene, the neglect of the crime scene, the way everybody else has. and he took that as an opportunity to make it into something. the scary interview for me wasn't talking to some media guy. that self-appointed prime minister. cnn has these amazing connects over there. right? they call me to my team and say we can get this self-appointed prime minister who had just released the statement saying he found the black boxes.
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i didn't even believe him. i said to my vproducer, there's no way this guy is going to do an interview. but he actually did it. we go in there, it is this crazy dark building. they have all the lights off in the building because they're afraid of security. spooky. through the elevator, you get out, these real deal russian military guys. not like these militias waving the guns at you all the time. can you tell from the time we've spent around the military. these are the real deal. my interpreter is talking to them in russian. he says to me, they are not from here. we don't speak russian the way they speak it here. so you're nervous. the self-appointed prime minister comes in. he's not a happy man. he's angry about being challenged and all this. but i felt like, our producer, our cameraman, our interpreter were all like, listen, we've got to drop the hammer on this guy because this is the opportunity and the questions have to be asked. but it is easy to say, if i had
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had a chance to interview, i would have told him. when you're looking at all these people who look only too anxious to make that the last trip the elevator you'll ever have. when that mad said to me, i am in charge here, i am the prime minister, this is my area, and he would not say that russia wasn't helping him pitch's never heard anything like that before. i kept looking over at my producer around looking at the interpreter saying, you getting this right? because the guy's telling me, i am the man here. i said, okay, well, they're saying that russia is training you and giving you stuff. is that true? all he had to do was say it's not true. even if it was a lie. he says i'm not going to answer that. you ask them. the question -- it was over for me at that point. >> chris cuomo, thanks for joining me. >> pleasure. we did get one piece of good news from ukraine yesterday. anton sciba was released by the pro russian rebels that had been holding him since tuesday. very good news.
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but there is bad news from iran, very bad news. a "washington post" correspondent and several other journalists are being detained by authorities in tehran. they've been there for several days. my next guest has unique insight into what might be going on because he was arrested in iran, too, and he was imprisoned for 118 days. his story is astonishing. you'll hear it right after the break. okay, movie night.everyone wins. how do i win? because we're streaming the movie that you love. well, how do i win? because we ordered that weird thing that you love from the pizza place. how do you win, dad? because i used the citi thankyou card and got two times the points on alllllll of this. well, and spending time with you guys of course. that was a better answer. the citi thankyou preferred card. earn two times the thankyou points on entertainment and dining out all with no annual fee. to apply, go to we're trying our best to be role models.dels. we don't jump at the sound of the opening bell,
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this morning, a "washington post" correspondent, jason ra site of on, is in government custody in iran. he is the first american journalist according to the "post" known to have been taken into custody there since 2009. he was arrested on tuesday evening along with his wife, a reporter for a newspaper in the united arab emirates. two photo journalists are also apparently being held. but that's just about all we know. we don't even know the names of the other two. so i checked in this morning with the executive editor of the "post." he said he still has not received any information about the whereabouts, condition or even why the journalist was detained in the first place. in a statement on friday he called it mystifying. he said that statement still holds true. nothing more to add at the moment. there has been a long history where unfortunately, of reporter arrest in iran. no one knows that better than a reporter for "newsweek" magazine in iran when he was jailed for
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almost four months. he wrote a book about his experience that jon stewart made into a movie. remember when stewart went off last summer for a hiatus? stewart was away directing this movie called "rose water." it will premier later this year. he now lives in britain. i skyped with him a couple days ago and asked for his reaction to this week's news. here's what he says. tell me about your experience. you wrote a memoir about your time in prison titled "then they came for me." you describe how a key piece of what they called evidence used against you was an interview from "the daily show." what was that. >> what they do when you arrive at a prison in iran is they throw charges at you. first they throw those charges and then they try to find the evidence to back it up. so my charge was that i was spying for the cia, the states
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and "newsweek." in absence of any evidence, they showed me an appearance on "the daily show" where jason jones, one of the reporters for "the daily show" was saying he was a spy, so they said you were talking to a spy. unfortunately, i can foresee a situation for jason, "the washington post" reporter who was arrested, to go through the same thing. >> you mean where they look for some sort of thing they can pretend is evidence and throw it at him? >> unfortunately, yes. and you have to understand that jason in prison, he's going to deal with very ignorant and very paranoid people. these are the people who spent most of the time in very dark and very small rooms insulth and beating people. >> it's harrowing to hear you describe the guards.
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the film that's being made, based on your experience, is titled "rose water." that's because one of the interrogators smelled like rose water? is that right? >> yes. he didn't, like many interrogators in islamic republic, i guess he didn't take shower enough and he was beating people. he was torturing people. he was insulting people. he was sweating a lot. in order to compensate that, he was using rose water perfume. i rarely saw his face. because when they take you to prison, they put a blindfold on. you're interrogated while you have that blindfold on and the only way you can communicate with the person is through sound and smell so i called him mr. rose water. >> interrogated, and also tortured, if i'm understanding correctly. can you tell us what happened in those instances? >> well, they don't treat you very nicely.
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there are different tortures. there is of course beatings, slapping, kicking. i'm not sure -- >> you describe it in a way that makes it sound almost casual. is that because there were so many days of this kind of treatment? >> the thing is that the reason i'm very nonchalant about the detaining, the kicking and slapping is because the psychological torture is more unbearable. i mean with beating and slapping, it's momentary pain and it can go away. but psychological torture, the way that they intimidate you, the way that they threaten your family, the way that they isolate you in order to imply different things. they basically instill fear in you. that is much more hard to endure. five years after i was arrested,
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sometimes i still have the film about your experience, "rosewater" will premiere in september and roll out across the country. what do you hope people take away from it? is there a message you hope is conveyed through it? >> i hope that they understand what journalists are going through when they're reporting, how far they have to go in order to gather a report they see on 6:00 on news or in their newspapers or on websites. and i just think that people in the west, especially the u.s. after watching that film, they have to appreciate what they have. >> i share your point about what journalists go through in these jobs. it doesn't seem like there's ever been a more dangerous time for a journalist in many regions of the world and that includes iran. >> exactly.
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the more paranoid this regime gets, the more paranoid they become of it. they think of information as their main enemy. they think that they don't regard journalists as a person. they regard journalists as part of this global phenomenon which is information. and they know the more informed people are, the more -- the territorial regimes become. and because of that, they target journalists more. >> information as their main enemy. that's an incredible thing to say. thank you for joining me. >> thank you. nice to talk to you. i'm awe struck by the way he talks so casually, so nonchalantly about being jailed like that. the committee to protect journalists says it is a dangerous time for journalists.
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in the first six months of the year, 61 journalists have died around the world, that compares to 40 in the same period last year. coming up next here on "reliable sources," we're going to look at how the partisan press has been reporting. some of the talking heads seem like they are stuck in the last century. i'll show you what i mean with red news/blue news after this. ups is a global company, but most of our employees live in the same communities that we serve. people here know that our operations have an impact locally. we're using more natural gas vehicles than ever before. the trucks are reliable, that's good for business. but they also reduce emissions, and that's good for everyone. it makes me feel very good about the future of our company. ♪ we've always been on the forefront of innovation. when the world called for speed... ♪
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it's time for red news blue news. my regular feature on reliable sources where i take a single story and show you how it's warped into something almost unrecognizable. and i've got a doozy for you this week, about presidents and world crises. in the wake of the downed malaysia airlines flight in ukraine. check out this chart. the daily page views for wikipedia's page. normally, a few hundred a day. but on july 17th, 87,000. that's because flight 17 was shot down that same day. and people wanted to read about russia's 1983 shootdown of korean air flight 007. soon, people were talking about it on tv here, too, but in very different ways. let's start with bright red news. on "fox and friends." >> reagan was clear, we know who did it. now we've got the president
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yesterday said putin must be accountable. the burden is on russia. oh, now they're shaking in their boots. >> you see what he's doing there. he's casting president obama 2014 as the weak subservient leader and reagan, 1983, as the strong leader that obama should be. now, this is happening all over fox news in the days following the mh 17 massacre. fox rachel maddow had cast reagan's response to 007 in a very different light. check this out. >> president reagan was on vacation when the shootdown happened. he initially wanted to stay on vacation and the white house initially said he would stay on vacation but then four days after it happened, president reagan was back in washington and delivering this sternly worded address to the nation. he said what the soviets had done was monstrous. >> it's almost like we're talking about two entirely
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different topics here. but the red team was ready with the response. you say four days, we say, well, here, watch. here's chris wilson on fox. >> when this happened with reagan, it took four days. remember how slowly information traveled back in the early 1980s. took four days. and he said, russia, we are not going to stand for this. >> the blue team, comes back at that. >> then there's this republican dream going on. if ronald reagan was in there, this would be so different. and the difference might be there would be no russian sanctions. no additional russian sanctions. he never imposed additional sanctions on the soviet union for anything they did. >> i could go on and on about this. it's debate by remote control. it's no wonder so many people were checking out that wikipedia page looking for a more neutral source. what stood out to me in reagan talk was this discussion on fox
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news. see what susan estrich says here. >> i'm not happy. but i think simply saying he needs to be stronger. you've got to back strength. reagan was dealing with a very different time. we knew who the enemy was. it was the soviet union. it was the cold war. not to take any credit away from him. but the problems obama faces are so different, and in some ways more complicated. >> let's rewind that tape just a few seconds and look at the screen. the screen is all filled up on fox news. white house foreign policy dilemma and world crises pile up. and the box on the right side have all these scary statistics. and the ticker at the bottom is a u.s. drone strike. susan is right, ronald reagan was dealing with a very different time. it was a time before modern cable news and a time before the internet. it's not the world is
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necessarily more unstable now. it's that we see and hear more of the global chaos in realtime. and if we want to, we can see it through red colored glasses or blue colored glasses. but i think we're better off when we take the glasses off, at least for a little while. that's it for red news/blue news this week and that's all for this edition of "reliable sources". but our media coverage continues all the time on and a great conversation we're putting online about whether the obama administration really is the most transparent in history. many journalists say it's not. set your dvr for next week sunday at 11:00 a.m. eastern time and we'll see you back here then. "state of the union" begins right now. the world on fire. from the middle east to ukraine to libya. power players from the hot spots.